Soulfly 5 : Dark Ages - Chaos and Light

-Max : No, I think this title has not just one meaning, and it represents personal dark ages of Dana, Moses, Dimebag Darrell, December, because December was when we made the most of the record. And then, there’s the situation of the world, if you look at reality, we are in a dark age now, with many problems. And then, there’s also a joke, kind of humorous face to Dark Ages like there’s so many crap music that we can say that we are in the dark ages of music, and we need to get out of it. So it’s a multiple name, with different meanings.

-Lyrically, Dark Ages is very inspired by those three deaths, Dana Wells, Gloria’s son, deceased in 96, Moses, Christina’s son, and Dimebag Darrell your friend : this record is a kind of homage paid to them?

-Max : Yes, it has a bit of that, and, in a way, it’s in a similar vein to ‘Soulfly I’, which has the same spirit, a similar spirit involved.

-It’s also dedicated to God, on the booklet…

-Max : Yes, and all Soulfly’s albums are, as well as ‘Root’s : all the albums I made after my son Zion was born. Not so many people know this but he had this very strange disease, that came when he was very young, eight months or something. We bring him to the doctor, which said that he had to cut his whole head, from an ear to the other. I cried a lot, I couldn't understand what was happening to my first son. So I made a promise and a prayer to God, asking him to do something, to help me. One month after that, it went away, the pain disappeared, nobody could explain that. I went back to the doctors, but everything was gone, and I became more religious after that. I found something I could understand: I didn't see it on TV, nobody told me about, it's for me the very real understanding of the search of God, I saw something really unbelievable in my own blood. All the albums are dedicated to God because of that single morning which changed my life.

-The inspiration is also, musically speaking, very back to the roots of metal and a bit less

tribal or ethnically orientated than before, with elements of hardcore, death metal, heavy metal, Nailbomb stuff : heavier, more aggressive…a need to make a break or go back to your previous love?

-Max : Well, people get old and get mellow, I get old and crazier! In my own way, it's very diverse, it's not a cheap metal record, it's very studied : I travelled and recorded with different people, and it has maybe more than anything else I've done, but it also is a big come back to aggressive and heavy stuff, which I love. In everything I do, I try to be unorthodox, unpredictable, but kind of fair, like a balance, so I felt that Soulfly needed to show to people a little bit of this dark side, because I've shown with Soulfly a lot of the other side, which is great and which I love, but I have those elements in me, very powerful and aggressive that are maybe the best stuff I can really make ; when I experiment with reggae, with world music, it's more of a jam and people can do that better than me. But when I do a traditional trash/ hardcore song, I think I can do pretty good and I like to do it. I love Nailbomb and the Sepultura old stuff and I love to include that in Soulfly, those are really good moments for the fans to hear that.

-With the insight, how do you look at Nailbomb today? Would you ever want to make it happen again?

-Max : No, it's finished, and the DVD is the last thing we did, and I think it's really great

to finish like that, it's a great show. I didn't think we would make a DVD, I didn't know that we had the footage, and when I heard that Roadrunner had the footage, I was very happy that they had, because people around the world didn't see that show, so it's a good thing people could see it. Nailbomb is very unique in all sorts of ways from the different musicians, the atmosphere of jam, the true kind of pissed off punk project : on the DVD, we don't even talk to the crowd, the only thing I say is :'Hello Holland, we're Nailbomb!' and after that it's just song after song, no talking and almost unfriendly, which is awesome, and really

cool, I think! I've never seen another band like that. All the other bands I've seen, even Slayer or Sick of it all are friendly with the crowd. Nailbomb wasn't friendly. I was uncomfortable.

I remember that, at the end of the concert, people were uncomfortable around Nailbomb's backstage and it was that strange vibe, nobody wanted to talk and everybody wanted to leave, because of this strange vibe! That's Nailbomb. It really was a special project. But I think Alex is really like that, he really doesn’t like live shows, he doesn’t like touring, he told me he didn't like the noise of the crowd. So I told him that he was gonna have a hard time being in a band, and he said he wasn't going in a band for a long time, quit some time and not play live anymore, rather do studio stuff, which is what he does right now. When people ask if we would do another one, it's impossible, I wouldn't do that and get in touch with anyone, because it's perfect like that, very cult-like. Nailbomb should stay something very special, really raw, pissed off and unique.

-A song like ‘Frontline’ is very politically oriented, and reminds of songs like Refuse/Resist or Arise, in this vein of protest songs?

-Max : Yes, 'Frontline' is basically about Bush, it's very easy to see, but beyond Bush, also about presidents and the powers that be who just send people to war and don't go themselves, never get hurt, never even get a scratch, a bandage. So I thought it was a good concept for 'Frontline' : I don't give a fuck, you don't give a fuck, we don't give a fuck, for me that's how Bush really thinks, he doesn't really care when he sends those young people to die in Iraq, I don't think so, because his priorities are oil and money, they are more important that human life. 'Frontline' is very close to 'Refuse/resist', which I really enjoy doing, because I think the fans will enjoy it, they wanna hear that kind of stuff. When 'Refuse/ resist' and 'Territory' came out, they were very unique, there was not a lot like it : Metallica

at the time stopped to make such hard topics and Slayer more evil and devil, which is cool, but nobody had a lot to do with hardcore, Discharge, Dead Kennedys which I loved a lot, and it's good to bring them back for Dark Ages. 'Babylon', the first song, is like that.

-Dark Ages has been recorded in Russia, Turkey and France: how did you choose those places?

-Max : I recorded in France with Stéphane, from DubPhonic, and I liked the recording so much, it sounded so live in the studio, I love what we did for Soulfly 3, very melodic and very cool, so I talked to the label and asked Stéphane to come and record Soulfly 5, here in Paris. It sounds great, the acoustic guitar is beautiful, I'm really happy to record here, in France. It's the first time I recorded something here. I think I'm gonna do it more and more with Soulfly, record an album not just in one country but more in different places. I guess that’s the influence from the world music : Peter Gabriel and these kind of guys, when you look at the credits on their records, sometimes record in ten different studios, and it's very hard because it's very expensive to go to all those places. But, little by little, the more popularity I get, I put my money back into what I believe : for me, it's worth it to spend money and come here and record in Paris, record in Russia and put that on a record, because a record is forever. In ten years, I'll look back and think that the best thing was to record like this, because that will mean even more ten years later than now, I like to think things like that at the time, it was the same thing for 'Roots' which sounded like a Brazilian tribe, it was exotic and different, but now everybody is completely happy about it, especially the label who didn't want to spend that much money on one track which was not a radio track but in fact a completely crazy track because there's no vocals, it's an obscure track, I even remember that they said they didn't understand why we would want to do this, and now, ten years later, it's one of the coolest thing we did, so I like to look at things like this, in the long run, more than just in the moment.

-Michael Whelan, did the cover sleeve, he already did it for 'Roots', 'Arise', 'Chaos A.D')

How did it happen?

-Max : Yes, and 'Beneath the remains' too. I have always liked those covers. The 'Dark ages' cover, is from the same artist as for Sepultura, but I think the vibe of 'Dark sages' is more Soulfly in the shape, the horns, the spikes, as Sepultura was more colourful, red, blue, as 'Dark ages' is very black and white, more like hardcore covers. It's very direct and very powerful : listen to the music and look at the picture, it's great together, a very good connection.

-Twenty years after your first demo, ’Bestial Devastation’, how do you judge your career in music? Was it what you expected?

-Max : Yes, its has been different than I thought, but that’s life : honestly, I didn't think that so much tragedy would be involved, it’s sad and hard, but on the other hand, it's why it made the music so much important. I started Sepultura with fun, and also with anger, from being poor, and the only thing I had to make me write some of the lyrics was my father's death.

So we were going with Sepultura and then tragedies came, Dana, then we split up. It has been different, but I think that, with tragedy, strangely enough, you can do music, and maybe if I hadn't lived through all this, it would have been a really different story, and music wouldn't mean that much, it would only be work, the money I make. So especially Soulfly is deeply in my heart, but Sepultura too : I'm torn between them.

I like both very much, but I like what I'm living right now. I'm thirty six and I do what I love doing, and I'm making my kid's dreams comes true in making music.

-This year, year of Brazil in France ; when will you visit us again?

-Max : Early next year, January I guess…

Interview made in Paris, August 22nd 2005.

Photos : dr.

Thanks to Karine et Laure, from Roadrunner France, for their help.